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America is burning

Started by Kon, May 28, 2020, in Life Add to Reading List

  1. reservoirGod
    Posts: 7,758
    Likes: 12,094
    Joined: Mar 7, 2011
    Location: Alaska

    reservoirGod

    reckless adventurer.

    Jun 1, 2020
    He was probably talking about the 5 police officers that were killed 5 years ago... not JFK.
     
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    Jul 13, 2020
  2. Antman
    Posts: 2,151
    Likes: 3,466
    Joined: Feb 15, 2011

    Jun 1, 2020
    Where tf is Kanye lmao
     
    Jul 13, 2020
  3. Boos
    Posts: 9,872
    Likes: 14,531
    Joined: Feb 15, 2011

    Boos

    Nova Nation

    Jun 1, 2020
    Being a loser. I wish he’d say something in support of the protests, but we all know he’d put his foot in his mouth and say something disheartening.

    At least he didn’t use the moment to selfishly plug a song like Eminem did though.
     
    Jul 13, 2020
  4. aleeex1972
    Posts: 1,012
    Likes: 1,636
    Joined: Nov 16, 2017

    Jun 1, 2020
    Those are not protests buddy, those are riots...don't confuse them!
     
    Jul 13, 2020
  5. Enigma
    Posts: 13,378
    Likes: 14,113
    Joined: Nov 27, 2014

    Enigma

    Civil liberties > Police safety

    Jun 1, 2020
    you missed like the last 20 pages of this thread lol
     
    Jul 13, 2020
  6. Boos
    Posts: 9,872
    Likes: 14,531
    Joined: Feb 15, 2011

    Boos

    Nova Nation

    Jun 1, 2020
    Seems the only one confused here is you. Keep doing your mental gymnastics though
     
    Jul 13, 2020
  7. asvdawg
    Posts: 3,703
    Likes: 5,528
    Joined: Feb 15, 2011
    Location: Toronto

    asvdawg

    Optimistic Leafs Fan

    Jun 1, 2020
    https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/nation-world/national/article243099076.html


    https://mb.ntd.com/nearly-a-dozen-earthquakes-shake-near-yellowstone-24-hours-usgs_471485.html/amp


    dw brah yellowstone already on it
     
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  8. Slyk
    Posts: 6,177
    Likes: 21,223
    Joined: Feb 15, 2011
    Location: Detroit -> Cali

    Slyk

    God made a prophet.

    Jun 1, 2020
    i haven't seen this posted here yet and it's really worth the 4 minute read, from Obama:

    How to Make this Moment the Turning Point for Real Change
    Barack Obama
    Jun 1 · 4 min read

    As millions of people across the country take to the streets and raise their voices in response to the killing of George Floyd and the ongoing problem of unequal justice, many people have reached out asking how we can sustain momentum to bring about real change.

    Ultimately, it’s going to be up to a new generation of activists to shape strategies that best fit the times. But I believe there are some basic lessons to draw from past efforts that are worth remembering.

    First, the waves of protests across the country represent a genuine and legitimate frustration over a decades-long failure to reform police practices and the broader criminal justice system in the United States. The overwhelming majority of participants have been peaceful, courageous, responsible, and inspiring. They deserve our respect and support, not condemnation — something that police in cities like Camden and Flint have commendably understood.

    On the other hand, the small minority of folks who’ve resorted to violence in various forms, whether out of genuine anger or mere opportunism, are putting innocent people at risk, compounding the destruction of neighborhoods that are often already short on services and investment and detracting from the larger cause. I saw an elderly black woman being interviewed today in tears because the only grocery store in her neighborhood had been trashed. If history is any guide, that store may take years to come back. So let’s not excuse violence, or rationalize it, or participate in it. If we want our criminal justice system, and American society at large, to operate on a higher ethical code, then we have to model that code ourselves.

    Second, I’ve heard some suggest that the recurrent problem of racial bias in our criminal justice system proves that only protests and direct action can bring about change, and that voting and participation in electoral politics is a waste of time. I couldn’t disagree more. The point of protest is to raise public awareness, to put a spotlight on injustice, and to make the powers that be uncomfortable; in fact, throughout American history, it’s often only been in response to protests and civil disobedience that the political system has even paid attention to marginalized communities. But eventually, aspirations have to be translated into specific laws and institutional practices — and in a democracy, that only happens when we elect government officials who are responsive to our demands.

    Moreover, it’s important for us to understand which levels of government have the biggest impact on our criminal justice system and police practices. When we think about politics, a lot of us focus only on the presidency and the federal government. And yes, we should be fighting to make sure that we have a president, a Congress, a U.S. Justice Department, and a federal judiciary that actually recognize the ongoing, corrosive role that racism plays in our society and want to do something about it. But the elected officials who matter most in reforming police departments and the criminal justice system work at the state and local levels.

    It’s mayors and county executives that appoint most police chiefs and negotiate collective bargaining agreements with police unions. It’s district attorneys and state’s attorneys that decide whether or not to investigate and ultimately charge those involved in police misconduct. Those are all elected positions. In some places, police review boards with the power to monitor police conduct are elected as well. Unfortunately, voter turnout in these local races is usually pitifully low, especially among young people — which makes no sense given the direct impact these offices have on social justice issues, not to mention the fact that who wins and who loses those seats is often determined by just a few thousand, or even a few hundred, votes.

    So the bottom line is this: if we want to bring about real change, then the choice isn’t between protest and politics. We have to do both. We have to mobilize to raise awareness, and we have to organize and cast our ballots to make sure that we elect candidates who will act on reform.

    Finally, the more specific we can make demands for criminal justice and police reform, the harder it will be for elected officials to just offer lip service to the cause and then fall back into business as usual once protests have gone away. The content of that reform agenda will be different for various communities. A big city may need one set of reforms; a rural community may need another. Some agencies will require wholesale rehabilitation; others should make minor improvements. Every law enforcement agency should have clear policies, including an independent body that conducts investigations of alleged misconduct. Tailoring reforms for each community will require local activists and organizations to do their research and educate fellow citizens in their community on what strategies work best.

    But as a starting point, here’s a "); background-size: 1px 1px; background-position: 0px calc(1em + 1px);">report and toolkit developed by the Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights and based on the work of the Task Force on 21st Century Policing that I formed when I was in the White House. And if you’re interested in taking concrete action, we’ve also created a dedicated "); background-size: 1px 1px; background-position: 0px calc(1em + 1px);">site at the Obama Foundation to aggregate and direct you to useful resources and organizations who’ve been fighting the good fight at the local and national levels for years.

    I recognize that these past few months have been hard and dispiriting — that the fear, sorrow, uncertainty, and hardship of a pandemic have been compounded by tragic reminders that prejudice and inequality still shape so much of American life. But watching the heightened activism of young people in recent weeks, of every race and every station, makes me hopeful. If, going forward, we can channel our justifiable anger into peaceful, sustained, and effective action, then this moment can be a real turning point in our nation’s long journey to live up to our highest ideals.

    Let’s get to work.


     
    Jul 13, 2020
  9. Chewie
    Posts: 2,105
    Likes: 3,207
    Joined: Jul 14, 2015

    Chewie

    a legendary wookie warrior

    Jun 1, 2020
    @Enigma @Donkey Kong Cuntry

    I understand what you’re saying, and perhaps I am not looking at the bigger picture. But even when I try to take a look at the bigger picture it’s hard for me to agree with everything you’re saying.

    I understandthe frustration that has been growing and growing in recent years (hundreds of years if you’re talking really big picture) and how it has led directly to this. I’m not arguing with you on any of that. The frustration of the protestors is no doubt 100% justified. However just because you have a valid reason to be frustrated doesn’t mean you can burn playgrounds down or do many of the other things that are being done. To that you say look at the big picture and if a playground has to be burned down to prevent another wrongful police killing then so be it. Well if that were the case then I agree. Burn as many playgrounds as it takes. However we all know that isn’t the case. The only thing the burning, the looting, and the violence is doing is making the other side more angry. The same side that we need to come to an understanding with in order to make real change.

    Enigma you said we disagree on where to place the blame. For the whole situation? I completely agree with you, decades of neglect by the system is to blame. However, for the playground being set on fire, the only blame to be placed there is the person who lit the match. No matter how validly frustrated he or she was, you have no reason to ever do such a thing. Just like the cops who are killing and assaulting innocent people. Obviously, one of those things is way worse than the other and when you look at the big picture the playground might seem so small in context but it is still wrong and something that should have never happened and to try to justify that isn’t right, as should no one justify what happened to George Floyd. Again I’m not trying to equate those two things, but my point is that both are wrong and it doesn’t matter that one provoked the other.

    As for what’s the alternative, it’s pretty simple don’t be violent, don’t loot, and don’t burn shit down. When the cops still mistreat those that are peaceful the world will see that and real change will come, however when it resorts to violence, looting, and destruction it does nothing but hurt the cause.
     
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  10. reservoirGod
    Posts: 7,758
    Likes: 12,094
    Joined: Mar 7, 2011
    Location: Alaska

    reservoirGod

    reckless adventurer.

    Jun 2, 2020
    Don't let @WPG see this... he hates Obama... he thinks he is worse than Trump because he is black.

    Real change comes from burning down minority owned blocks of the Bronx.
     
    Jul 13, 2020
  11. FiveOh1
    Posts: 2,208
    Likes: 2,999
    Joined: Mar 5, 2011

    FiveOh1

    Too Real Entertainment

    Jun 2, 2020
    I participated in the protests in downtown Little Rock. I recorded a 20 minute video of people speaking and the crowd on my Facebook if anyone wants to see that. We did the peaceful protest
     
    Jul 13, 2020
  12. Slyk
    Posts: 6,177
    Likes: 21,223
    Joined: Feb 15, 2011
    Location: Detroit -> Cali

    Slyk

    God made a prophet.

    Jun 2, 2020
    figured this was rhetorical, and i think we're reaching the point of ad nauseum, so i left it, but i see that you addressed the same question to @cpt awesome WPG joint acc, so i'll hit you with my thoughts..

    i 1000% agree with you -- with all of you -- on the macro level. i think that's apparent, and if not, then i want you to know that now. i don't want any of this either, but it's come to this and i'm not blinded by the necessity of the pointed destruction rn. i just want that destruction to be appropriately directed and to not be a wreckless free-for-all where anxy teenagers go out to f--k some shit up simply knowing that they can place the blame on the civil unrest. or where coordinated efforts across criminal groups are hitting targeted areas each night with no motive but personal gain. or where opportunists charade in masks of protestors who are actually standing for change and aren't there for personal instant gratification. or where snakes chameleon their way through the crowds to let their aggressions out on mom n pop shops. and so, my answer to your very difficult question would simply be: eliminate these specific types of micro behaviors, and then i'd be onboard with 100% of both the macro and as well as the rest of the micro levels. would that be easy to do? f--k no. but it is a better, viable, way. and it's okay to be disappointed in those who are preventing this from happening.

    it really is interesting that while you, myself, @Enigma , @cpt awesome WPG joint acc , & @Chewie are seemingly in agreement on that macro level, we can't come to agreement on the micro (even myself and chewie are in disagreement on portions -- i don't care about *parts* of the destruction, while he is against it entirely -- and that's okay). it may seem petty, but it really is quite important because we're not the only ones spending so much energy on this, with others doing so on much larger & louder platforms.

    i'm trying to phrase this closing thought in a way that isn't, "lol, see -- obama even agrees with me!", but i do think that the 4th paragraph of his Medium post from above is what i've been desperately trying to say for the past 30 pages now. these minority efforts are detracting from the overall cause and they shouldn't be excused. and that's been the problem in my eyes -- and frankly, has been the only problem in my eyes. if we (even just the 5 of us) had shared the same sentiment from the start (whether it had been your train of thought, or mine, or someone elses -- not relevant), then this entire thread would have been a much more macro-level discussion, and alone, we would have made more positive, public, awareness (if even a little). i said it in a previous message to you, @Donkey Kong Cuntry , but this thread alone is so spot-on representative of the larger media's focus/divisiveness + other individuals' conversations -- hell, i pulled up my fb feed and this was the largest topic being discussed -- which has already proven to detract from the macro message at hand and has larger populations of civilians ultimately torn on what's going on...and if nothing else, that's super interesting (and a very sad result).
     
    Jul 13, 2020
  13. Slyk
    Posts: 6,177
    Likes: 21,223
    Joined: Feb 15, 2011
    Location: Detroit -> Cali

    Slyk

    God made a prophet.

    Jun 2, 2020
    shit i should have included @Boos in there as well ^
     
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  14. Ordinary Joel
    Posts: 27,531
    Likes: 66,850
    Joined: Mar 23, 2015
    Location: South Australia

    Ordinary Joel

    Found a new way to flow

    Jun 2, 2020
    But it's not that simple, and seems idealistic?
     
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  15. FiveOh1
    Posts: 2,208
    Likes: 2,999
    Joined: Mar 5, 2011

    FiveOh1

    Too Real Entertainment

    Jun 2, 2020
    I will say the judges definitely protect cops, we had a crooked cop here that killed someone and the mayor and police chief had him discharged and arrested and the judge dismissed it and reinstate him
     
    Jul 13, 2020
  16. Zeugma
    Posts: 2,439
    Likes: 3,721
    Joined: Nov 24, 2014

    Zeugma

    I'm tryna take a break from the internet

    Jun 2, 2020
    I saw on twitter you've been arrested @WPG ?? are you okay?
     
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  17. Koolo
    Posts: 47,984
    Likes: 146,136
    Joined: Feb 14, 2011

    Koolo

    SAS IS THE NEW KANYE

    Jun 2, 2020
    Gri probably has found god and been praying non stop for this to end before the weekend so he doesnt have to be exposed
     
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  18. WPG
    Posts: 11,150
    Likes: 20,317
    Joined: Feb 15, 2011

    WPG

    retired

    Jun 2, 2020
    fresh out of jail. i’m good. thank you.
     
    Jul 13, 2020
  19. Koolo
    Posts: 47,984
    Likes: 146,136
    Joined: Feb 14, 2011

    Koolo

    SAS IS THE NEW KANYE

    Jun 2, 2020
    While its not simple. Long term its more sustainable
     
    Jul 13, 2020
  20. The Real Slim Shady
    Posts: 1,866
    Likes: 3,446
    Joined: Feb 15, 2011

    Jun 2, 2020
    ‘400 years of slavery.... sounds like a choice to me!!’

    Why the f--k would you ever care about that prick again after that?
     
    Jul 13, 2020